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Beginning A Dialogue. May 18, 2008

Posted by littlebangtheory in Politics and Society.
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Last weekend as I sped through the heart of our local Teeming Megalopolis® of Greenfield, I paused at the light in the Heart of the Theater District (well, ok, there’s only one movie theater there, so let’s go with “center of town” instead) to give a “thumbs-up” and a thank-you to the weekly anti-war protest on the common (Saturdays, 11am ’till noon,) and noticed a counter-protest across the street – a few gentlemen with large and, to my cardboard-and-crayon mind, impressive signs with somewhat inflammatory messages like, “Want to piss off a Liberal? Try defending your country!”

Well, not being one to shy away from conflict, and having spent altogether too much time in the last year commiserating with like-minded individuals about our disdain for King George The Lesser and our disgust for the direction his idiotic ideologies have taken Our Country in the last seven-plus years, I decided I’d go back this weekend and see if they’d be there again.

You know, for a little friendly get-acquainted chat.

Well as 11 o’clock rolled around, the Peace-niks began to assemble on the town common, many meandering out of the weekly Organic Farmers’ Market where I’d just purchased some heirloom tomato plants and a few other goodies for my (soon-to-be) garden. I’m sure you’re familiar with the scene- Birkenstocks, pony-tails, braided armpits (j/k) and Sunflower Sparkle-Pony serenading the crowd with a guitar and a lilting trill, something about peace and love and shit.

I’m actually not a big fan of folk music, but hippy chicks give me wood, and I can put up with quite a bit of Sonic Pablum in deference to my Little Man.

Anyway, at The Appointed Hour the anti-war protesters came…

…and came…

…and came…

…and in fact, the number grew considerably as time passed, though this was the last picture I took of them.

Meanwhile, and more to the point of my foray, the anti-Anti-War-Protesters protesters had set up their counter-demonstration across the street:

On this particular occasion, it appeared at first glance that four guys and six five-gallon pails of sand were deeply disturbed by the Un-American Activities going on over on the town common.

But first impressions can be deceiving, and besides, four guys had given the middle of their sunny Saturday over to expressing their views, indeed, defending their viewpoint, and I thought they deserved a fair hearing. So after a lively round of how-ya-doin’s with the Peace Folks, several of whom I know and love, I headed over to the other side of the street to get to know the Anti-Anti’s.

They were at first understandably suspicious, having no doubt just watched me hugging other men, fer Gawd’s sake, but I began the interaction by thanking them sincerely for taking the time to represent their views in this decidedly “blue” venue, asking them if any of them were veterans, and thanking the one who was for his service. And in the interest of full disclosure, I told them that I disagreed with pretty much all of the viewpoints espoused by their signs.

But before they got to taking that too personally, I also shared the reason for my being there: my belief that what we have in common far outweighs what separates us.

What followed was a half-hour conversation between them and me, during which they expressed their frustration and anger at being misquoted, misrepresented and made to look like idiots by the local press (this I believe, as the local print media are indeed self-righteously liberal to a degree which far outpaces their national counterparts) and got to summarize their primary beefs with their counterparts across the street, those being that 1) protesting the war is unsupportive of our troops in Iraq at a time when they need our unequivocal backing, and 2) Us Lefties® are socialists, and socialists are bad, antithetical to The American Way.

And while I disagreed with them on both of these points, I bit my tongue and listened. And that earned me the right to ask them some pertinent questions.

Like, How come the rest of the First World Nations can provide Universal Health Care to ALL of their people for way less money than Americans spend on health insurance which doesn’t even cover all of our children?

Like, how can we defend prosecuting a war of aggression against a country which never attacked or even threatened us?

Like, why are we believing that high gas prices are The Arabs’ fault while Exxon-Mobil logs all-time World Record Profits quarter after quarter after quarter?

Like, where have all the patents for 100mpg carburators gone?

Like, why are American CEOs making hundreds of millions of dollars a year while their employees are losing their jobs in cost-cutting maneuvers?

And many others. It’s presently late, and I’m losing steam here, so I’ll cut to the quick:

We need to talk to each other. Not just to people who see things as we do, but most especially to people who see things differently. Because these people are Americans too, and they truly care about their country, our country, just as you and I do. And it serves no purpose to assume they’re idiots because we think they’re ill-informed. They VOTE based on what they believe, on what they think they know, and if they’re wrong, their children, our children, will have to live with the consequences.

I hope to make it back to the Other Side of The Street next Saturday, and the Saturday after that, and the Saturday after that, for as long as we can talk to each other, listen to each other, get to know each other as Real People who want to make the world a better place for our kids.

We have an awfully long way to go; perhaps we ought to get started.

Comments»

1. FranIam - May 18, 2008

CR – you are my hero, my hero indeed!!

What you have done here is an extraordinary thing and it shows the virtue of listening and talking. It elucidates the importance of staking out what we have in common.

Honestly if we don’t we are sunk and many of us on the Left are as guilty as those on the right of wanting things “our” way.

If I demand my place at the table, it cannot be at the expense of someone else’s seat. That keeps the fire stoked, unfortunately.

Cooperation and mutuality mean just that. If we do want peace, we have to be willing to be open otherwise that quest for peace is just another sword in disguise.

And if we want peace and we don’t start within ourselves – well I am not saying another word… If that is not obvious, I don’t know what is.

Good on you!!!

2. pagan sphinx - May 18, 2008

Firstly, this is an extraordinary post. It depicted a scene which is familiar to me, (though I’m not usually downtown on Saturdays anymore and I’ve not seen the counter-protesters) and it made me laugh out loud several times; though I did groan a little about the hippie chick giving you wood – I guess they don’t call it the little head for nothin’. Sheeesh 😀

I love it that you did this. I am interested to know their responses to your questions and I hope you follow up with some of that.

I listen to what my neighbors have to say. There are several WW II vets who live on my street and W.P.’s parents served in the war as well. They’re mostly confused. War in their time meant something that it no longer means. They want desperately to believe in the country on whose behalf they once served. In this they’re not alone. Isn’t that what we all want? I hope when you go back you will give those folks that message.

Today, my friend, I am in awe of you!

Love,
Gina

3. pagan sphinx - May 18, 2008

P.S.
Did you hear that the new GI Bill passed in the House? I wonder how the counter-protesters feel about Bush possibly vetoing it if it reaches his desk? I mean that question in a sincere way, not sarcastically.

Heck, I may very well join you one of these mornings!

4. Suzi Riot - May 18, 2008

Good for you! It’s often too easy to stay in our comfort zone of thoughts and opinions. There is a limit, however, to how far these discussions can go sometimes. I stop listening patiently when the conversation turns to racism and gay-bashing.

I have a couple of very close conservative Republican friends and while I enjoy listening to their ideas and having friendly debates, sometimes we have to call a truce because we realize we’re not going to convince each other of anything and we’re going to end up in a fight. Obviously, these friends are not the racist, gay-bashing types, since I wouldn’t be friends with them if they were!

5. Bubs - May 18, 2008

Brilliant commentary. So, beyond seeing that the anti-anti war demonstrators care deeply about our country, did you get the opportunity to find any other common ground? Did they identify any of the same problems that you did? Were there any simple connections about non-political related stuff?

By the way, Fran sent me.

6. Randal Graves - May 18, 2008

If they did indeed, after initial misgivings, willingly talk to you without getting overly emotional and ridiculous, lucky you. The majority of the wingnuts I know descend into misguided anger and stupidity almost immediately, to be followed by an unending stream of Hannity-esque soundbites. 🙂

7. Bob - May 18, 2008

When I establish Phydeauxia, you are so going to be my SecState (in addition to your duties as Chef). 🙂

8. sherry - May 18, 2008

i’m proud of you, and them all, for actually talking.

i know a lot of right wingers.they used to pat me on the head as i was their token little liberal and female to boot. i never took offense because that just closes off any hope of a meaningful exchange of ideas and besides i’ve never been an “in your face” type.

now, even they have admitted just recently that the country has been sold out by men with millions who wanted billions and that our vets are being screwed over and hey, what the hell happened to america…?

now, i find them listening more to me and dismissing me less. it’s a start.

9. QuakerDave - May 18, 2008

“We have an awfully long way to go; perhaps we ought to get started.”

I would say that’s what happened here. Exactly.

10. Christy - May 18, 2008

Hey there, I got to your blog from Fran’s and I loved this post. What you say seems quite common sensical, but I know it’s something that I need to be reminded of on a regular basis. Nice job!

11. Diane - May 18, 2008

Great great great post. that’s all I can say right now. I wish churches could lead the way talking across the divides, and then asking questions about how all of us can reflect the values we profess.

12. littlebangtheory - May 18, 2008

Wow – such supportive words!

OK, from the top:

Fran, au contraire, mon soeur! How I wish I had your wisdom and understanding – fer Gawd’s sake, I can’t even understand many of your posts these days, my feeble mind won’t hang onto a train of thought that long! But thanks SO much for your affirmation of my approach. I suspect it will be an up-stream swim, and I’m basically a sinker.

Pagan Sphinx, aren’t you still a Hippy Chick, or have you gone Yuppy on us?? 🙂 And you’re welcome to join me any Saturday, though I’m thinking we might scare them off if we come on too strongly, so I guess I’m asking you to wait a bit ’till I form more of a personal connection with these guys. I fear that nothing will be gained if we cause them to “circle the wagons.”

Suzi, I have SO many points of contention with these folks, but that’s not why I’m there – I’m searching for our commonalities. When they start in with their O’Reilly-esque dogma, I try to listen without getting too worked up, then bring it back to finding common ground.

I’m an untrained hack at this, so I’m sure there are better approaches, but I’m working with what I’ve got.

Bubs, thanks for stopping by – that Fran’s a keeper, eh?

No, this was a first “hello,” and I didn’t press it. One of the men seemed more “hard-core” and distrustful than the others, and may be hard to connect with. But I’m sure he’s a Passionate Patriot, and I’m not about to dismiss his views. The others were a little more approachable, and left me feeling a bit more hopeful about finding common ground.

Randal, My Very Good Man, I hope you know that I respect you and agree with you on many levels. But I made a commitment a while back to try to avoid name-calling and derisive comments, as I see them as destructive to the process of initiating dialog. I also gave these gentlemen my blog address in the hopes that they’d come here and engage us in a conversation, and I want them to be comfortable doing that. So please, please leave the labeling at home, and please. please come here often and help in this endeavor. It’ll be on-going if it happens at all, so do check in when you can and apply your considerable brain power to the task. Thanks in advance for that.

Bob, I’m honoured (in my best Monty Python English) and look forward to filling those shoes as you conquer the known world…

Sherry, I’ve endured more than my share of head-patting (slapping would be morre accurate, as Benny Hill was all the rage when I was in school) and despise it mightily. Sorry to hear that you’ve endured the same.

But more currently, I’m seeing the same thing – it’s getting harder and harder for real Republicans to stomach the bullshit being served up by their leaders as the disastrous results become progressively more obvious.

QD, thanks for stopping by! I’ve been a bad blog buddy of late, pretty much tied up in my own small world of photography and food. But yes, it’s a start, and may not lead to much, but I feel like I have to do something…

Christy, welcome! My socio-political offerings have been rare lately, but there’s something stirring inside me recently which may translate into more.

And this endeavor on the town common seems to warrant my effort and attention, at least as long as there’s a glimmer of hope for some kind of connection.

Thank you all for your feedback on this post. And please come back soon – I’ll be asking for your help with links and information which might be informative for my new acquaintances across the street.

Peace,
Ralph

13. littlebangtheory - May 18, 2008

Diane, thanks for stopping by (apparently while I was composing my “war and peace” response 😉 )

Good point about churches – don’t they have a stake in this? Or are they just going to cover their butts by backing the most overtly church-pandering party without questioning the human consequences of that decision?

I’m sorry if that sounds cynical, but I’ve been waiting with growing impatience for my alma mater (the Catholic Church) to step up to the plate on this one, and if they’ve done that, I’m afraid I missed it.

Thank God for voices like Fran’s which give me hope that The Church is more than just a vapid embodiment of Jesus’ teachings!

14. pissed off patricia - May 19, 2008

Yours is the sort of mind we need to clone. Damn, that was a hell of an effort and a wonderful post.

15. dguzman - May 19, 2008

Great post–and way to practice the art of conversation. BTW–did the guys have any answers to your questions?

16. littlebangtheory - May 19, 2008

PoP, you’re too kind, but I’ll take it anyway. 🙂 And stick with me here, ’cause I’m gonna need a LOT of help turning this initial step into an actual conversation. Details at eleven. 😉

And DG, no, a lot of, “Hmmm, that’s a good question,” but not too many answers yet. The apparent organizer went to his truck and got me a photocopy of some semi-Ann-Coulter-style talking points (while I held his sign, much to the chagrin of the Peace contingent across the street) which attributed a lot of pro-war rhetoric to prominent Democrats, while insisting that I’d never read it (which I did. Without vetting the contents, it was indeed embarrassing.) But next Saturday’s a-commin’, and I’ll ask again, along with giving them the touché! regarding the talking points.

Hey, if we claim to be perfect and have all the answers, we’ll NEVER become One America.

17. Mauigirl - May 20, 2008

Great post, and I totally agree. We need to understand what the “other side” believes and be willing to listen. There is no point in just shouting at each other over a divide.

I love the pictures of your town green – our town has one that is almost IDENTICAL – and ours too has peace demonstrators on Saturdays! For a moment I thought you must live here!

18. beatgrl - May 20, 2008

Thanks for doing that, CR, you’re awesome.

I tend to get tongue tied, all blushing and flustered when I try to have these sorts of dialogs. And that’s with my own relatives.

Interesting symbolism seeing the two pictures next to each other, with the lefties at the park, and the righties in front of the bank.

19. Jennifer - May 20, 2008

You are a hero, Ralph.

And that you want to continue to reach out, with sanity. I’m in awe. Almost nobody does that.

20. littlebangtheory - May 20, 2008

Jennifer, so glad you stopped by. I’ve been such a non-entity in your blog-o-sphere, yet thinking of you folks constantly.

I’m going to ask for your help, the collective “your” that is. Please check back in, as I know you’re capable of contributing to this effort, and I also know that I can’t do it without you.

– R

21. Dusty - May 21, 2008

CR..this is so moving to me. I do not have the patience to talk to the ‘other side’ as you are sir.

I respect you immensely for your ability to cut through the bullshit and do what we all should do….talk to those we disagree with.

You would make a wonderful addition to any presidents cabinet CR.

22. TheCunningRunt - May 21, 2008

((blushes))

Thanks, Dusty. But I have a hard enough time showing up for the Saturday Morning tete-à-tete!


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